Wednesday, March 17, 2010

Sihanouk's fall played fateful role

Sihanouk at his arrival in Moscow in March 1970
Lon Nol
On April 15, 1970, Sihanouk declared in a message, "Henceforth, I shall irreversibly be engaged in combat." He spoke of his "single objective of establishing in Cambodia a socialist regime whose leaders would be, on the one hand young, progressive nationalists, and on the other, communists.

And that's where we are today in Cambodia.
March 17, 2010
By A. Gaffar Peang-Meth
Pacific Daily News (Guam)


Forty years ago tomorrow, on a ride to Moscow Airport, Soviet Premier Alexei Kosygin told Prince Sihanouk that the prince had been removed from power as Cambodia's chief of state.

The events that led to Sihanouk's downfall and those that followed cause me to write today's column with a heavy heart. Cambodia's national tragedy cost Cambodians two million lives and delivered the country to Vietnamese expansionism. The tragedy also took my parents' lives, alienated some of my best friends and separated me from the land of my birth.

Had those in power chosen different courses of action, much loss could have been avoided. As Karl Marx said, "History does nothing; it does not possess immense riches, it does not fight battles. It is men, real, living, who do all this."

Men tend to reject what they don't conform to their view, because not to reject means accepting they were wrong. They look for what supports their views, brush off what doesn't, and they dig in.

To argue that Sihanouk's overthrow brought the Vietnam War to Cambodia ignores the reality that Cambodia's compromised neutrality under Sihanouk's leadership brought Vietnamese infiltration and U.S. response across the Cambodian border long before the overthrow.

To argue U.S. bombings gave rise to the Khmer Rouge overlooks Sihanouk's role in their expansion and the years of support they received from Vietnamese and Chinese communists. The support continued even when the Khmer Rouge's atrocities were impossible to ignore.

Eventually, the Khmer Rouge, having developed a sense of omnipotence, became defiant of their Vietnamese benefactors. This led to the December 1978 military invasion by Vietnam. The success of that invasion led to the ouster of the Khmer Rouge, the establishment of a Vietnamese puppet regime in Phnom Penh, and the imposition of the 1979 unequal treaty of peace, friendship and cooperation, which opened the door to Cambodia becoming part of greater Vietnam, in fulfillment of Ho Chi Minh's dream.

We shall never know what now King Father Sihanouk and deceased former Premier Lon Nol conspired to achieve in March 1970.

"Les absents ont toujours tort," the French say. "The absent are always in the wrong" -- they cannot defend themselves.

Sihanouk won't tell. His political missteps led to Vietnamese presence in Cambodia as they fought their compatriots and the Americans. To get the Vietnamese communists out of Cambodia, Sihanouk reportedly told Lon Nol to organize anti-North Vietnamese and anti-Vietcong demonstrations, which got out of hand March 11.

On that day, Sihanouk told journalists, "I plan to ask the Russians and the Chinese authorities to ask the Vietcong to leave us in peace," otherwise Cambodia might go to "the right" with Lon Nol. Reportedly, Lon Nol assured Sihanouk on that day there was room for friendship with the communists, but the Lon Nol government told the communists to depart before dawn on March 15.

Seizing the political moment, an enraged Sihanouk denounced Lon Nol and company before leaving Paris for Moscow on March 13: They were "more patriots of the dollar than patriots of Cambodia."

Eventually, it was reported that a cassette recording of a closed-door meeting came to light. In the meeting it was alleged that Sihanouk threatened death to government leaders and Lon Nol. In Moscow later that day, Soviet President Nikolai Podgorny urged Sihanouk to return right away to Phnom Penh.

In Peking, China's foreign ministry summoned French Ambassador Etienne Manac'h on March 15 to ready an Air France plane to fly Sihanouk to Phnom Penh as soon as he arrived from Moscow. Press media reported from Phnom Penh of festive preparations to welcome Sihanouk along the road from Pochentong Airport.

But Sihanouk postponed his trip to Peking.

Lon Nol was said to have dragged his feet against Sihanouk's ouster until the evening of March 17, when he allegedly was confronted with the tape. On March 18, the Cambodian parliament voted 92 to 0 to depose Sihanouk as chief of state.

On March 21, the prince told the press in Peking: "It is absolutely not my intention to try to regain the power which I lost."

But two days later, on March 23, he reversed himself. Over Peking Radio, Sihanouk called on Khmers and foreign residents "to engage in guerrilla warfare in the jungle against our enemies," and announced the formation of the "National Union Government," the "National Liberation Army" and the "National United Front of Kampuchea."

In his "message and solemn declaration," Sihanouk spoke of personal revenge: "In the struggle which I am determined to see to its end (or at least until my death in the underground which I will soon join), I seek among other things, one personal goal. ... I will say that I want revenge."

On March 26, the Vietnamese Communists began military action in Cambodia's southern provinces.

On April 15, 1970, Sihanouk declared in a message, "Henceforth, I shall irreversibly be engaged in combat." He spoke of his "single objective of establishing in Cambodia a socialist regime whose leaders would be, on the one hand young, progressive nationalists, and on the other, communists.

And that's where we are today in Cambodia.

A. Gaffar Peang-Meth, Ph.D., is retired from the University of Guam, where he taught political science for 13 years. Write him at peangmeth@yahoo.com.

41 comments:

Anonymous said...

Yuons invaded Cambodia, Americans bombeb Yuons in Cambodia and Khmers died.
Sihanouk was right, he didn't trust Americans, Sirimatak did and he paid the price.

Anonymous said...

Sihanouk built modern Cambodia. He also brough it down to year zero. I'm both admired and hated this man.

Anonymous said...

It was a miscalculation on both sides, Prince Sihanouk and General Lon Nol.

It was through the end of the Lon Nol Regime that the then South Vietnamese army broke the Brevi line and took islands off Kampong Som, to add to what the Vietcong had taken along the Eastern border.

Anonymous said...

Thank you Mr. Peang-Meth
It is another eye-opening about our history and our king. Death to the idiot King who never take advice from his subordinates.

Anonymous said...

I hated this man to the bone since I learnt to talk and walk...
Sihanouk is/was cold bloodthirster and power Hunger. Khmer rate him as King Killer of Kampuchea!

I Thanks and regret the Vietnamese volunteers army, Samdech Akkak Maha Sena Padei Decho Hun Sen Varman, whose my Creator, Mentor and Savior of Kampuchea and Kampuchean to come and liberated us from Sihanouk/Pol Pot khmer rouge regime on 7, Jan. 1979.

We, kampuchean should call Samdech Akkak Maha Sena Padei Decho Hun Sen Varman, is the THEVADA Hun Sen.


H.E. Ou Sovann
Member of CPP/MA/USA

Anonymous said...

Only an idiot creates another generation of idiots that control our country till today. and Ou Sovann must be an idiot to love another idiot.

Anonymous said...

What ?
Tevada ?
Which one ?
A Kwak ?

Anonymous said...

What a dumb Cambodian PM Hun Sen. He has nothing to worry about Thailand whatsoever but watch his dirty mouth before he start talking to anybody. I get tired of him talking in Khmer and make no sense. Please all Khmer in Cambodian need to stand up like Thailand and other country to kick a dictatorship like HUN SEN out of power now before him, his family and his gangster ruin your children and your future. Rise up all Khmer in Cambodia

Anonymous said...

Don't be so stupit your opposition fuck up now why you still fucking dump ass?

Anonymous said...

រឿងពឹត

ឆ្នាំ១៩៧០,ដោយមិនអាច ដេញកងទ័ពយួន​យៀកកុងឈ្លានពាន(ដែលព្រះអង្គផ្តល់ជំរក​ ក្នុងទឹកដីខ្មែរ),ព្រះមហាវិរក្សត្ររត់ចោល
ជាតិ នរោត្តមស៊ីហនុ បាន រត់ទៅមើលព្រះរោគ នៅប្រទេសបារាំងក្នុងជន្មាយុជាង៤០ ផ្លាយឆ្នាំដ៏រឹងមាំ ។ ព្រះអង្គមិនហ៊ានត្រឡប់ចូលស្រុកវិញទេ, បើទោះជារាជ រដ្ឋាភិបាល បានចាត់ទ្រង់នរោត្តម កន្តុលឲ្យ ទៅយាង ព្រះអង្គពីស្រុកបារាំង​ក៏ដោយ , គឺព្រះអង្គទុកឲ្យ លោក លន់ណុល នាយករដ្ឋមន្រ្តីស្រោចស្រង់ជាតិ ទទួលខុសត្រូវ​នូវវាស្នាប្រទេសជាតិខ្មែរ ។
ដោយសារអវត្តមាន ព្រះប្រមុខរដ្ឋកម្ពុជា រដ្ឋសភា​ជាតិខ្មែរ បានបោះឆ្នោតទំលាក់ព្រះមហាវីរក្សត្ររត់
ចោលជាតិ នរោត្តម ស៊ីហនុ ចេញពីតំណែង, ព្រឹត្តិការណ៏ ១៨ មិនា ១៩៧០ ក៏កើតមានឡើង ។
ក្រោយពីការប្តូររបបរាជានិយមទៅជាសាធារណរដ្ឋមក ព្រះមហាវីរក្សត្ររត់ចោលជាតិ នរោត្តម ស៊ីហនុ ក៏លែងឈឺ ហើយបានទៅសុំសេចក្តីជ្រក កោណពីលោក គ្រុតឆូវ ប្រធានាធិបតី សម្ព័ន្ធសង្គម
និយមសូវៀត តែមិនបានសម្រេច,ហើយក៏រត់មក​ដល់​ ស្រុកចិនកម្មុយនិស្ត ។ ពេលនោះព្រះមហាវីរ
ក្សត្រ រត់ចោលជាតិ នរោត្តម ស៊ីហនុ ដោយមាន​ចិនជាបង្អែក លែងស្គាល់ខុសត្រូវព្រះអង្គធ្វើជា​ប្រមុខ​ដឹកនាំ, ប្រមូលទាំងអស់នូវទ័ពខ្មែរក្រហម ប៉ុល ពត, ខ្មែរវៀតមិញ, យួនយៀកកុង ព្រមទាំងអំពាវនាវ ដល់ ពលរដ្ឋខ្មែរឲ្យរត់ចូល​ព្រៃម៉ាគី ដើម្បីប្រឆាំងជាមួយរបបសាធារណរដ្ឋខ្មែរ
សង្គ្រាមស្រុកខ្មែរក៍បានកើតឡើង​ ដូច្នេះវាជា
កំហុសរបស់របបសាធារណរដ្ធឫ​?
ខ្មែរឆ្នេរជលសារវែង

Anonymous said...

As much as I respect the Khmer scholars or other scholars like Dr. Peang, I have to say this:
-Dr. Peang and some of these Cambodians who lack of understanding about politics and a very long conflicts between Vietnam and Cambodia since the past centuries until today are playing Hanoi's games to tear Khmer society apart.

Dr. Peang writing seemed to shift blame on the King but not the Yue Nam (Yuon) who have been presence in Cambodia for about 500 years.

Gen Lon Nol and the King were working together to free Cambodia from the Yuon, but the Gen's strategy was destroyed due to too many Yuon espionages were among his army, so the King had to carry on.
Dr. Peang didn't write at least two big reasons: 1) Cold war and Stalin instructed China to supervise Ho Chi Minh to take Cambodia and Laos at all cost; 2) Yuon's expasionism marching toward South now toward west must not stop (copied from Genshis Khan, Marching until the end of the earth), and without China to stop these aggressive Yue Nam (Yuon), no one could.
It seems that Dr. Peang as a KHmer son is after all playing Yuon's card. Look at his PhD's friend named Naranh Kiritith. He too also serves the interest of Yuon because in all his writings are nothing more but to split Khmers apart.

What the asnwers? Do Dr. Peang and his friend Dr. Naranh Kirith know how?
/-

This to a low life "Ou Sovann". You are the worm, the idiot, the parasite in any society, and if any one has the right mind can read English, they to know that are you are nothing but a low life of Yuon Spy. Stop pretending taht you are Khmer anymore. Most Khmers love and respect the King only Yuon like you who hate the King but love Hun Sen. And you love Hun Sen that's telling all who you are. You are Yuon spy.

Anonymous said...

Thank you Dr. Gaffar Peang-Meth for writing about recent Cambodia history. I learned it through many Western authors, but I would appreciate if you could someday write a book about our recent tragic and turbulent history.

Maybe some of ignorant CPP will read it but all of their children will surely read your book to understand how Cambodia’s demise.

Anonymous said...

Ignorant CPP is not all right, how about the Ignorant non-CPP like yourself?

I am not a CP's supporter nor Rainsy's. The ignorant people are the people like yourself who writes with out real references.

Anonymous said...

Let ECCC in Phnom Penh free and Independent.

“A critical test for the success of the [tribunal]—as for all courts trying international crimes—is that the judicial process be allowed to run its course without political interference,” James Goldston, executive director of the Open Society Justice Initiative, in New York, told VOA Khmer.

The group remains concerned over government objections to trials of lower-tiered Khmer Rouge and of the senior officials’ refusal to testify, he said.

“It is important for the rule of law in Cambodia that decisions about whom to charge, what to charge and who should testify be made by judges, not politicians,” he said.

come on Sihanouk courage!

Anonymous said...

The tragedy Khmer rouge turned mostly around sihanouk and yuons. Other accomplices just pushed sihanouk more deep inside in yuon hell. Lon nol was just a tool or servant of sihanouk, always at sihanouk feet ready to do anything for sihanouk even to sacrifice his own people and nation.

French/De Gaule want revenge against USA while yuons want revenges against Khmer who refused to join with yuons to set yuon long dream and that being acted through sihanouk/Khmer rouge, communist and youn pawn/clone. Those who pushed Cambodia in Vietcong/Khmer rouge hands are all responsible for the massacre of millions Khmer people by Vietcong/Khmer rouge to be replaced by yuon migrants and the current tragedy of Cambodia.

Anonymous said...

Who dat? I dunno!

Anonymous said...

Of course we couldn't spectulate of the "what if...than...", but what I hope the lesson learn for future Khmer generation...now it is up to each Khmer generation to make it better than the last...otherwise the Khmer people will become minority in their own land...and eventually will exsting...Khmer leaders should lead Khmer to prosperity and not sale the country out...you will be judge by the history...

Khmer leader should have shame because in the international community, the first thing they would ask is where are you from? --so leaders -- are you happy to say that you are part of corrupt govt.?

Please accept your title responsibly...don't create your title inflation "which mean nothing..one you're out side of Cambodia.."

Anonymous said...

shut up OU so van as Amerougecan citiezn.you shoul not force ppls to follow your stupid idear.

Anonymous said...

4:36 AM you have valid opinion and acknowledgment about yuons but while it comes to your king sihanouk, you are being so blind and so ill. You target very one and everything who don’t share your vision of your sihanouk, so bad that you can even kill those innocent people . I believe, in your ideal, your king is so immense, so giant that it blinds all your vision. You cant pretend to anti yuon but pro sihanouk because sihanouk always work for his throne and for yuons so the yuon spy or confused person is not other but yourself who drawn confusion and division among people.

Anonymous said...

Ah masear Ou Sovann, how much ah yuon CPP pay you to look down on your own citizens? Is that consular
job make you that way? Ah chun ro mil kun thoak teab, ah chun kbott pak, ah kjom yuon!

SRP sponsored you.

Anonymous said...

If Sihanouk didn't take this matter as a revenge of those who disposed him, we wouldn't be this poor.

Sihanouk and Yuon killed khmer. Total number close to 3 millions.

Anonymous said...

All Khmers,

Our Mtherland, Cambodia, will be ceased to exist at the turn of this 21st century, and will be a 2nd Champa.

Nuon Khoeun had predicted our destruction, but nobody took his advises.

Khmer leaders were, are so stupid. They don't care their own Race, Nation, and Khmer Identities are being VIETNAMISED until today.

Continue to sleep, Khmers, and your DESCENDANTS will curse you as TRAITORS of the Country of Cambodia.

Anonymous said...

ousavan means ousava ,i heard ,hun sen wiil send with cheam yeap'wife to make a baby in his crocdise pond.is that true? i don't know ,may be you're lucky with vakimhong's mother. remember don't sue me for defamation?ok commrade?

Anonymous said...

5:45 AM dont be that ill, it can be Ou Sovann as it can be someone else who use his name as they can use other people name as well. it is cyber space. you know this individual ou sovann better than any one, does such opinion can be from that individual ou sovan?

Althouhg if that individual is from cpp, that does not surpris me at all, why then you srp sponsored such an individual? dont u have better thing to do?

Anonymous said...

Thank you Dr Peang Meth!


With all due respects,would you care to promt ourself on the current circumstances that cambodians have faced as human?.

They are majority living in HELL standards,not in any living standard.

What are the keys to resolve and progress to the society that you are so concerned,and once belonged to, in a name of intellectual?.


The poors are stil waiting!!!.

Please accept my humble apology.

Neang SA

Anonymous said...

Dr. Peang-Meth, beside trying to idolize and promote his good friend Dr. Tith Naranhkiri, is trying to attack the king with yet another of his lop-sided writings. His article here will surely influence the young generations who have not experienced and learned about the real cause of the real tragedy. Many historians have put the blame squarely on the 1970 coup that toppled Sihanouk. Without the coup, the Khmer Rouge will be a footnote to history. The coup and Lon Nol's incompetence and corruption led many peasants to join the KR, even without Sihanouk's cooperation, the KR will grow in strength because of Lon Nol's corruption and abuses against peasants. About letting the Vietcong stay in cambodia, who was the defense minister and armed forces commander? It was Lon Nol who was the one selling and transporting military equipments to the Vietcong from Kampong Som, even after he ruled the country the business with Vietcong still take place right through to 1973.

It was hardcore republicans like Dr. Peang-Meth should be the ones to be blamed for ruing cambodia and caused the death of 2 million lives. Without their stupidity, Cambodia would be on par with Thailand because during the Sangkum Reastr Niyum, Cambodian teachers earned more than Thai teachers, Cambodian movies are as good as Thai movies and people live in abundance and peace. Dr. Peang-Meth and Dr. Tith should be thankful that their fathers, a senior civil servant and a minister, thrived under Sihanouk and that both of them had a chance to get an education overseas because of Sihanouk's excellence education system.

Anonymous said...

Lon Nol was killed Khmer people,too.

Anonymous said...

I think only the new revolution can answer to today society in Cambodia. Political party is not going to win or resolve the currence problems! Unless Hun Sen party and yuon are dead from Cambodia.

Anonymous said...

THE TRUTH FINALLY REVEAL!

Anonymous said...

Gen. Lon Nol was killed only khmer traitors such as khmer sihanoukist, khmer kraham yuon, khmer yuon vietminh and khmer yuon vietcong.

I Remembered March 18, 1970, around 9:30am at Phsar Touch, Tuol Kok, Prek Phnov, and elsewhere in Cambodia were mocked yuon whose were allowed to live in Cambodia by Sihanouk and Monique.

Anonymous said...

If Sihaknuk knows Youn were try to rob khmer soil more than five hundred years .Did Sihaknuk do some some thing to protect Cambodia?
Called youn to hide out and help youn defeat the American.
Married with the YOUN lady(Monique).
Making kids every where as he pleased .
Making movie to challenge with Kong Sam Oeun.
Compose the song and sing him self to challenge with Sin Si Sa Mouth.
Create khmer rouge and one time the king of democratic khmer rouge him self.
Oh too much to disgrace this man named Sihaknuk he is an idiot, Dr.Meth he is right all the way.
Thanks you Dr. Meth

Anonymous said...

Democratic Kampuchea Pol Pot Khmer Rouge Regime

Members:
Pol Pot
Nuon Chea
Ieng Sary
Ta Mok
Khieu Samphan
Son Sen
Ieng Thearith
Kaing Kek Iev
Hun Sen
Chea Sim
Heng Samrin
Hor Namhong
Keat Chhon
Ouk Bunchhoeun
Sim Ka...

Committed:
Tortures
Brutality
Executions
Massacres
Mass Murder
Genocide
Atrocities
Crimes Against Humanity
Starvations
Slavery
Force Labour
Overwork to Death
Human Abuses
Persecution
Unlawful Detention


Cambodian People's Party Hun Sen Khmer Rouge Regime

Members:
Hun Sen
Chea Sim
Heng Samrin
Hor Namhong
Keat Chhon
Ouk Bunchhoeun
Sim Ka...

Committed:
Attempted Murders
Attempted Murder on Chea Vichea
Attempted Assassinations
Attempted Assassination on Sam Rainsy
Assassinations
Assassinated Journalists
Assassinated Political Opponents
Assassinated Leaders of the Free Trade Union
Assassinated over 80 members of Sam Rainsy Party.

"But as of today, over eighty members of my party have been assassinated. Countless others have been injured, arrested, jailed, or forced to go into hiding or into exile."
Sam Rainsy LIC 31 October 2009 - Cairo, Egypt
  
Executions
Executed over 100 members of FUNCINPEC Party
Murders
Murdered 3 Leaders of the Free Trade Union 
Murdered Chea Vichea
Murdered Ros Sovannareth
Murdered Hy Vuthy
Murdered Journalists
Murdered Khim Sambo
Murdered Khim Sambo's son 
Murdered members of Sam Rainsy Party.
Murdered activists of Sam Rainsy Party
Murdered Innocent Men
Murdered Innocent Women
Murdered Innocent Children
Killed Innocent Khmer Peoples.
Extrajudicial Execution
Grenade Attack
Terrorism
Drive by Shooting
Brutalities
Police Brutality Against Monks
Police Brutality Against Evictees
Tortures
Intimidations
Death Threats
Threatening
Human Abductions
Human Abuses
Human Rights Abuses
Human Trafficking
Drugs Trafficking
Under Age Child Sex
Corruptions
Bribery
Embezzlement
Treason
Border Encroachment, allow Vietnam to encroaching into Cambodia.
Signed away our territories to Vietnam; Koh Tral, almost half of our ocean territory oil field and others.  
Illegal Arrest
Illegal Mass Evictions
Illegal Land Grabbing
Illegal Firearms
Illegal Logging
Illegal Deforestation

Illegally use of remote detonation bomb on Sokha Helicopter, while Hok Lundy and other military officials were on board.

Lightning strike many airplanes, but did not fall from the sky.  Lightning strike out side of airplane and discharge electricity to ground. 
Source:  Lightning, Discovery Channel

Illegally Sold State Properties
Illegally Removed Parliamentary Immunity of Parliament Members
Plunder National Resources
Acid Attacks
Turn Cambodia into a Lawless Country.
Oppression
Injustice
Steal Votes
Bring Foreigners from Veitnam to vote in Cambodia for Cambodian People's Party.
Use Dead people's names to vote for Cambodian People's Party.
Disqualified potential Sam Rainsy Party's voters. 
Abuse the Court as a tools for CPP to send political opponents and journalists to jail.
Abuse of Power
Abuse the Laws
Abuse the National Election Committee
Abuse the National Assembly
Violate the Laws
Violate the Constitution
Violate the Paris Accords
Impunity
Persecution
Unlawful Detention
Death in custody.

Under the Cambodian People's Party Hun Sen Khmer Rouge Regime, no criminals that has been committed crimes against journalists, political opponents, leaders of the Free Trade Union, innocent men, women and children have ever been brought to justice.

Anonymous said...

Sihanouk and his Cousin Bhumibol was on the mission from China to murder South East Asia to expand the Communist. Om Sari Matak and Om Lon Nol are the heroes for all us Khmer people. Sihanouk is a dog.
Khmer Poi Pet in US.

Anonymous said...

8.26am, have you checked in a mental hospital yet ?

Anonymous said...

Well, It could be an interesting for me if you all could focus how we are solving problems appropriatly, making friends for harmony and having a happy living today, tomorrow.
If you so worries about the past you are just wasting time and passing mental discease into every one in here.
Lets have the opportunity to build a better life for all Cambodian! Thats what I am proud of. My man.

Anonymous said...

Dr Meth, could you write for regular Khmers, we are not strong in English, I don't see at all that you blame Sihanouk.

Anonymous said...

I am not really against the Kings (King father and King son). However, I see that this royal family is very selfish. They don't care much about the people and the country, but they care about themselve first. Sihanouk would kill any body who dared against him while he was in the power. To save the palace, the King son had to sign the amendment treaty. Of cause the whole royal family agreed and urged the King son to sign to treaty.

Win said...

The big problem of Cambodian leaders is coward to the true. They are braved to kill their own poor people, but are coward before foreigners. Pot Pol=Hun Sen= Sihanouk. Sihanouk has delicious of Youn pussy water (monineath).

Anonymous said...

និយាយច្រើនមែន​ អាមាត់ពាងប្រហុកនេះ! យើសអាចោលស្រុក!!!

Lon Nol

Anonymous said...

history is interesting. thank god they're history!

Anonymous said...

aah kanouk norodumb, lon nol, pol pot, hun xen....they all the same same shits.....In my life time....I never see a Khmer true hero like the Varman dynasty....