Op-Ed by KJE
Posted at http://www.about-cambodia.blogspot.com/
On one of my recent visits to Cambodia I asked a friend of mine whether the Khmer people in Cambodia hate the Vietnamese as much as the overseas Khmer.
His reply was, ‘Nobody likes the Vietnamese, only Hun Sen does.’
I had asked because all the Khmer blogs, forums, and other English-language publications on the web display a thorough, deep-seated, and often-times virulent, hate of the Vietnamese people in general and the Vietnamese government in particular. This seems to be somewhat surprising given the fact that it was the Vietnamese that liberated Cambodia from its stone age Communist Pol Pot regime, which, after all, managed to kill 2 million Khmer, either directly through executions or through starvation.
So perhaps a quick look at its history will reveal some insight into the reasons for this ever lasting hate, which, it appears, goes only in one direction as both Thais and Vietnamese do not harbor the same feelings towards Khmer. Their attitude towards Khmer people can maybe best described by arrogance, or even contempt, though even that has slowly been undergoing change. Nowadays it seems to be more indifference than anything else.
Like all neighboring countries in the world, Cambodia and Vietnam were at war at one time or another throughout their history. War obviously is in the human nature. Whether it is a war to gain territory, a war over birthrights, a war along ethnic lines, or a war over religion, people have always found a reason to go to war.
Cambodia because of its size and population has not been a powerful country in the region for a long time. Bordering Thailand and Vietnam have always overshadowed Cambodia. However, during the Angkor period the Khmer Empire was an advanced civilization. Though it declined after the 13th century it remained a powerful country until the 15th century. Many wars with its neighbors, however, left it weakened, and the Thais finally defeated Angkor in 1432 (see Wikipedia for a full timeline). Even after that, the empire conducted many wars with the Thais and the Vietnamese, which only resulted in the loss of more territory. Ever since the Khmer Kingdom had been subservient to both neighbors.
A king who had been installed by the Thais in the 19th centuries finally sought protection from the Thais from France, which would lead to Cambodia finally becoming a French colony in 1863. In that respect Vietnam did not fare any better as it was also colonized by the French in the mid-1800s.
Thailand has never in its history been a colony of a foreign power with the exception of the Japanese occupation during WW II. The Thai people derive considerable national pride from that.
After gaining independence from France in 1954 following the Indochina War, Vietnam was divided into Communist North Vietnam and republican South Vietnam. Of course, we all know that in 1975 the Communists took over South Vietnam after first having defeated the U. S.’ efforts to defend South Vietnam, who withdrew in 1973, and then the South Vietnamese forces.
After the U. S. withdrew from Indochina the Communist insurgent movements in Laos and Cambodia gained the upper hand, and Pol Pot toppled the Lon Nol government in Cambodia. To pursue its goal of hegemony over the region the Vietnamese invaded Cambodia and drove the Pol Pot regime into the jungle 4 years later where the Khmer Rouge continued to battle both the Vietnamese occupation forces and the Vietnamese installed Cambodian government until 1993, when the first free UN-sponsored elections were held. The Vietnamese forces had withdrawn from Cambodia in 1988. Jan. 09 is celebrated in today’s Cambodia as a day of liberation from the evil forces of Pol Pot. The opposition sees it as the day Cambodia lost its independence to Vietnam.
It is widely held that Vietnam pursued a policy of uniting Laos, Cambodia and Vietnam into one Indochinese Communist state under the government or at least leadership of the Vietnamese. Vietnam did, however, lack the economic foundations. History in a way overtook that concept with the Soviet Union’s policy of perestroika and glasnost, finally its collapse. Vietnam itself introduced an opening towards the free world by its own Doi Moi (renovation) policy, which implemented free market reforms in Vietnam.
During Vietnams 10-year occupation of Cambodia they exploited Cambodia’s natural resources to bolster their own weak economy and to preserve their own resources. They literally plundered the country. Before the occupation 80% of Cambodia was covered by forest. That had dwindled to 45% at the end of their occupation in 1988. Unfortunately, the subsequent Hun Sen regime, both under the Communist banner, and as reformed democrats after 1993, continued this exploitation on a large scale.
Thailand on the other border has been a staunch U. S. ally since WW II, which contributed to its economic development. In the late 1960s and 1970s Thailand was a staging area for U. S. forces in the Vietnam War and became infamous as an R&R place for GIs in that time. Though a multitude of coup d’etats hampered modern development, Thailand nonetheless embarked on its road to prosperity in the early 1970 with the advent of international tourism. Heretofore it had been a languid, agricultural, and exotic country. It is now one of the 5 Asian Tigers with a strong economy, and it certainly dwarfs both Cambodia and Vietnam, though the latter has made great strides to become the sixth Asian Tiger.
Cambodia, on the other hand, had remained a backward country due to the Pol Pot period and the subsequent isolation from the outside world. Going to Cambodia in 1989 was like going back in time by about 50 years. Modern development did not start until after 1993, when the first free elections were held.
It would appear that it is exactly this backwardness and their economic inferiority to its neighbors that led to this sentiment of animosity towards both neighbors. These feelings were not helped either by the influx of Thais and Vietnamese after Cambodia opened its borders in 1993 to foreign investments. It was a country for modern adventurers. The state was bankrupt. There was literally no money in the State Bank, Cambodia did not have anything that could be sold to the highest bidder, no industry to speak of, there was no electrical power in most of the country, people survived on subsistence farming. Government officials plundered state coffers of its foreign reserves for their own private purposes. The only money-making business in Cambodia at that time was logging. This is what the Thais and Vietnamese came for. Though it was eventually outlawed in the 1990s, it continued unabated, spurred by corruption. About 40% of the price of the relatively cheap logs and lumber went into government officials’ pockets. Both Thais and Vietnamese businessmen took advantage of this situation, as, despite the high share of corrupt money in the price of wood, it was still cheap by Thai standards, and the Vietnamese just wanted to protect and preserve their own forests. Contributing to this fact was that logging was illegal in Malaysia, Thailand, and parts of Indonesia. These countries initially constituted the main customers for wood from Cambodia. There was and continues to be a very lucrative market for exotic semi-precious and precious hardwoods.
The years immediately following the opening of the country created a climate of free-for-all reminiscent of the robber-barons in colonial America. Adventurous businessmen from neighboring Vietnam and Thailand, as well as Malaysia, Singapore, and South Korea streamed into Cambodia. A military clique controlled the forests and were eagerly selling, mostly illegally cut, logs to those rapacious businessmen, pocketing hefty profits. All this money, of course, bypassed the general population. This could not go unnoticed by the population who was for most part still on the verge of starvation and did not know where the food for the next day would come from. But Khmer, in fact most Asian, people are rather stoic, being devout Buddhists, accepting their poverty as their fate, even in the face of a few getting rich. The Communist dictatorship contributed its share of suppressing any nascent form individualism.
Since the Vietnamese were the main buyers of Cambodian wood over a longer period of time the Khmer people came to see them as the main villains, which were later complemented by the other Asian nationalities, such as the Thais, Malays, and Indonesians. The population also knew very well that Hun Sen had been installed by the Vietnamese government during their occupation. So they continued and still continue to see the Vietnamese as their oppressors, trying to steal their land.
Though Cambodia is nominally a democratic free country, Hun Sen and his government rule the country with an iron fist, suppressing any emerging strong opposition with any means available, including intimidation, vote-buying, phony law-suits, etc. The masses remain more or less docile as Hun Sen’s CPP network pervades all strata of government throughout Cambodia. The one opposition party was rendered leaderless at one time for almost 2 years by having the chairman, Sam Rainsy, sentenced to a jail term for defamation of Hun Sen. Sam Rainsy was later pardoned by the King and returned to Cambodia, albeit in a much more agreeable and pliable form.
Nevertheless, Sam Rainsy and his party lambaste the CPP for stuffing voter rolls with Vietnamese nationals to ensure an absolute victory for the CPP in the next elections to be held in July 2008.
Sam Rainsy is practically running on an anti-Vietnamese platform.
Current Khmer society on the whole is rather uneducated, and that includes the upper echelons of the country’s leadership. Cambodia lacks an educated elite, from which impulses can arise and be passed on to the general population. This, of course, is the result of the virtual annihilation of the existing elite under the Pol Pot regime. This tends to make people to think in very simple terms and to see things in black and white. They are not able to make educated and informed assessments and judgments of given situations. They are very susceptible and responsive to blaming outsiders for their misfortune.
Again, looking back in history this appears to be a false impression, as it was their own King who asked the French for help. And it was again their own King who did not object to an arbitrary French ruling that gave the so-called Cochin-China to Vietnam, also called Kampuchea Krom, which covered the Mekong Delta and which had and still has a Khmer minority, when French rule over their Indochinese colonies ended.
Kampuchea Krom is a very serious bone of contention between the nationalistic faction of the Khmer population, especially overseas Khmer, and the current Cambodian government and the Vietnamese government. The resultant dislike or hate from this fact is unfortunately extended to the entire Vietnamese people who are seen as land-grabbers, and generally dishonest and shifty people. But it must not be overlooked that this part of Vietnam, though originally settled by Khmer, has been Vietnamese for 4 centuries. To claim it is still Khmer and to have it ceded back now seems somewhat absurd.
It was again a Khmer king who allowed Vietnamese refugees fleeing from a war to settle in this region in the early 17th century. In the following years ever more Vietnamese settled in the region and roughly 90 years later the Vietnamese installed their own administration, which practically separated this region from Cambodia. Cambodia was too weak to counter this because of its ongoing wars with the Thais. Kampuchea Krom has been Vietnamese ever since. The only chance to get it back was in 1954, but the French granted it to Vietnam without any opposition from the then King Norodom Sihanouk.
Lately, the relatively unhindered immigration of Vietnamese in practically free Cambodia has also irked most Cambodians. They also perceive them to receive very favorable treatment by the current government. Additionally, 2 years ago Cambodia and Vietnam concluded a border treaty delineating a firm borderline for many previously contested regions with Vietnam. Large chunks of Cambodian territory are considered to have been ceded to Vietnam by the current government. This claim is made not only by the opposition party but also by the former King Sihanouk.
It appears that all the Khmer contentions that they were wronged by their neighbors is not borne out by historical facts. But nonetheless a sort of inferiority complex evolved from this, which continues to make this a very volatile issue in some quarters. The Kampuchea Krom and border issues also leave the very bitter taste that the Cambodian people always get the short end of the stick in their relationship with their neighbors.
Nevertheless, the Vietnamese ‘guest laborers’ that had come to Cambodia in search of jobs in the early 1990s were considered good and reliable workers, much better in many respects than their Khmer counterparts. This fact was underlined by many Khmer builders who exclusively used Vietnamese workers in the construction business in that time. This picture has slowly changed over the years as Khmer workers acquired the skills to put them on an equal footing with the Vietnamese.
The U. N. sponsored elections in 1993 and its preparation brought in a great number of U. N. forces from all over the world, which was seen as a great opportunity to make money by prostitutes. Consequently, a great number of Vietnamese ladies of the night came to Cambodia to ply their trade there. As a matter of fact, during that time about 90% of all prostitutes in Cambodia were Vietnamese. Decent Khmer people saw this with dismay and lumped all the Vietnamese together as pimps, prostitutes, and thieves. Seeing Cambodia as a practically lawless country at that time this also appears to have been the time when criminals began using Cambodia as a major transit point for human trafficking. Again, many of those gangsters have been Vietnamese, though many young rural Vietnamese girls are also their victims.
In comparison to Vietnam Cambodia is a free country, though not fully by Western standards. But this continues to lure Vietnamese (and Chinese) people in search of jobs to Cambodia. Unlike Vietnam (and China) life is virtually uncontrolled by any authority, nobody pays taxes, and if you are apolitical Cambodia compares very favorably to their home country. Vietnamese do not need visas to enter Cambodia but Khmer need visas to go to Vietnam.
The Thai and Vietnamese economies are much larger and stronger. Vietnam, despite its still Communist authoritarian rule, managed to elevate its country from a developing to a threshold country in the past 19 years, whereas Cambodia in almost 15 years of quasi-democratic rule is still dependent on foreign aid for 50% of its budget. Before Cambodia will reach the same level of development it will take at least another 10 to 15 years. There are, of course, vast disparities in both countries’ infrastructure, but it would seem that the rigid authoritarian Vietnamese rule accomplished more than the robber-baron rule of a capitalist Cambodia. The ruling clique there is seen to line its pocket to the detriment of their own people hampering progress for the benefit of the people.
Given all these facts and aspects it is easy to understand, at least on the surface, the dislike, aversion, or even hate some Khmer people harbor against the Vietnamese. On the other hand, there is a great number of marriages between these two nationalities. There seem to be two factions utilizing this anti-Vietnamese feeling – one, the overseas Khmer who for the most part are very nationalistic, similar to their overseas Vietnamese counterparts, and two, the opposition parties in the country. Overall the population in Cambodia might not really like their neighbors but they have come to accept their presence and live with it. At worst, I believe it may be called an ambivalence.
For the overseas Khmer, however, judging from their publications, it is outright hate. Of course, it is safe for them to rant and rave living more or less comfortably in the U. S. or France. But their contention that Vietnam will one day occupy Cambodia again is outright ludicrous. Of course, Vietnam and Thailand will pursue their interest in their dealings with Cambodia, but the times of outright colonialism in any shape or form are forever over. No Western or Asian power will stand by and watch Vietnam annex Cambodia. Thailand has never committed any acts of aggression against their neighbors in modern times anyway and one is hard-put to see Thailand invading Cambodia.
Both Thais and Vietnamese are very friendly and hospitable, the same as Khmer. It is hard to understand for a foreigner to see some Khmer to usurp these sentiments for their one-sided goals. Shouldn’t reconciliation be the major objective? One can only hope that the younger generation, which will be more educated and because of their exposure to the mass media and internet, will come to see these things in their proper context and use their minds and ambition to build a better society free from hatred against their neighbors.
Europeans know about this best. They managed to unite countries that had been at war throughout history into one union without borders, with a common currency, and a joint political body. Yes, there are still resentments among certain nationalities. It is noteworthy, though, that it is mostly lower class people who hold those resentments. The better educated the more open-minded the people will be. Similarly, once the young Khmer will have achieved at least a semblance to other nations in the region, and have gained some stature among their neighbors, those resentments or harsher sentiments will slow diminish and finally disappear, maybe not completely, but they won’t be a significant factor in their relationships with their neighbors.
As for overseas Khmer, their views ought to basically be discounted as they have no major influence in Cambodia itself. They are too far removed from events and do not have the wherewithal to play a major role in Cambodian politics. There are about 300,000 overseas Khmer in the U. S. and Europe. Most of them have enough on their hands carving out a living in their host countries to care about politics in Cambodia. Eventually, the second and third generation will assimilate into their host societies completely and not think of themselves as Khmer but as Americans and French, or whatever they are. But the present anti-Vietnamese, anti-Thai propagandists should try to educate themselves a little more in order to understand that the world is not black and white, and that fostering hate is self-defeating and negativistic. Hate has no long-term chance of survival.
His reply was, ‘Nobody likes the Vietnamese, only Hun Sen does.’
I had asked because all the Khmer blogs, forums, and other English-language publications on the web display a thorough, deep-seated, and often-times virulent, hate of the Vietnamese people in general and the Vietnamese government in particular. This seems to be somewhat surprising given the fact that it was the Vietnamese that liberated Cambodia from its stone age Communist Pol Pot regime, which, after all, managed to kill 2 million Khmer, either directly through executions or through starvation.
So perhaps a quick look at its history will reveal some insight into the reasons for this ever lasting hate, which, it appears, goes only in one direction as both Thais and Vietnamese do not harbor the same feelings towards Khmer. Their attitude towards Khmer people can maybe best described by arrogance, or even contempt, though even that has slowly been undergoing change. Nowadays it seems to be more indifference than anything else.
Like all neighboring countries in the world, Cambodia and Vietnam were at war at one time or another throughout their history. War obviously is in the human nature. Whether it is a war to gain territory, a war over birthrights, a war along ethnic lines, or a war over religion, people have always found a reason to go to war.
Cambodia because of its size and population has not been a powerful country in the region for a long time. Bordering Thailand and Vietnam have always overshadowed Cambodia. However, during the Angkor period the Khmer Empire was an advanced civilization. Though it declined after the 13th century it remained a powerful country until the 15th century. Many wars with its neighbors, however, left it weakened, and the Thais finally defeated Angkor in 1432 (see Wikipedia for a full timeline). Even after that, the empire conducted many wars with the Thais and the Vietnamese, which only resulted in the loss of more territory. Ever since the Khmer Kingdom had been subservient to both neighbors.
A king who had been installed by the Thais in the 19th centuries finally sought protection from the Thais from France, which would lead to Cambodia finally becoming a French colony in 1863. In that respect Vietnam did not fare any better as it was also colonized by the French in the mid-1800s.
Thailand has never in its history been a colony of a foreign power with the exception of the Japanese occupation during WW II. The Thai people derive considerable national pride from that.
After gaining independence from France in 1954 following the Indochina War, Vietnam was divided into Communist North Vietnam and republican South Vietnam. Of course, we all know that in 1975 the Communists took over South Vietnam after first having defeated the U. S.’ efforts to defend South Vietnam, who withdrew in 1973, and then the South Vietnamese forces.
After the U. S. withdrew from Indochina the Communist insurgent movements in Laos and Cambodia gained the upper hand, and Pol Pot toppled the Lon Nol government in Cambodia. To pursue its goal of hegemony over the region the Vietnamese invaded Cambodia and drove the Pol Pot regime into the jungle 4 years later where the Khmer Rouge continued to battle both the Vietnamese occupation forces and the Vietnamese installed Cambodian government until 1993, when the first free UN-sponsored elections were held. The Vietnamese forces had withdrawn from Cambodia in 1988. Jan. 09 is celebrated in today’s Cambodia as a day of liberation from the evil forces of Pol Pot. The opposition sees it as the day Cambodia lost its independence to Vietnam.
It is widely held that Vietnam pursued a policy of uniting Laos, Cambodia and Vietnam into one Indochinese Communist state under the government or at least leadership of the Vietnamese. Vietnam did, however, lack the economic foundations. History in a way overtook that concept with the Soviet Union’s policy of perestroika and glasnost, finally its collapse. Vietnam itself introduced an opening towards the free world by its own Doi Moi (renovation) policy, which implemented free market reforms in Vietnam.
During Vietnams 10-year occupation of Cambodia they exploited Cambodia’s natural resources to bolster their own weak economy and to preserve their own resources. They literally plundered the country. Before the occupation 80% of Cambodia was covered by forest. That had dwindled to 45% at the end of their occupation in 1988. Unfortunately, the subsequent Hun Sen regime, both under the Communist banner, and as reformed democrats after 1993, continued this exploitation on a large scale.
Thailand on the other border has been a staunch U. S. ally since WW II, which contributed to its economic development. In the late 1960s and 1970s Thailand was a staging area for U. S. forces in the Vietnam War and became infamous as an R&R place for GIs in that time. Though a multitude of coup d’etats hampered modern development, Thailand nonetheless embarked on its road to prosperity in the early 1970 with the advent of international tourism. Heretofore it had been a languid, agricultural, and exotic country. It is now one of the 5 Asian Tigers with a strong economy, and it certainly dwarfs both Cambodia and Vietnam, though the latter has made great strides to become the sixth Asian Tiger.
Cambodia, on the other hand, had remained a backward country due to the Pol Pot period and the subsequent isolation from the outside world. Going to Cambodia in 1989 was like going back in time by about 50 years. Modern development did not start until after 1993, when the first free elections were held.
It would appear that it is exactly this backwardness and their economic inferiority to its neighbors that led to this sentiment of animosity towards both neighbors. These feelings were not helped either by the influx of Thais and Vietnamese after Cambodia opened its borders in 1993 to foreign investments. It was a country for modern adventurers. The state was bankrupt. There was literally no money in the State Bank, Cambodia did not have anything that could be sold to the highest bidder, no industry to speak of, there was no electrical power in most of the country, people survived on subsistence farming. Government officials plundered state coffers of its foreign reserves for their own private purposes. The only money-making business in Cambodia at that time was logging. This is what the Thais and Vietnamese came for. Though it was eventually outlawed in the 1990s, it continued unabated, spurred by corruption. About 40% of the price of the relatively cheap logs and lumber went into government officials’ pockets. Both Thais and Vietnamese businessmen took advantage of this situation, as, despite the high share of corrupt money in the price of wood, it was still cheap by Thai standards, and the Vietnamese just wanted to protect and preserve their own forests. Contributing to this fact was that logging was illegal in Malaysia, Thailand, and parts of Indonesia. These countries initially constituted the main customers for wood from Cambodia. There was and continues to be a very lucrative market for exotic semi-precious and precious hardwoods.
The years immediately following the opening of the country created a climate of free-for-all reminiscent of the robber-barons in colonial America. Adventurous businessmen from neighboring Vietnam and Thailand, as well as Malaysia, Singapore, and South Korea streamed into Cambodia. A military clique controlled the forests and were eagerly selling, mostly illegally cut, logs to those rapacious businessmen, pocketing hefty profits. All this money, of course, bypassed the general population. This could not go unnoticed by the population who was for most part still on the verge of starvation and did not know where the food for the next day would come from. But Khmer, in fact most Asian, people are rather stoic, being devout Buddhists, accepting their poverty as their fate, even in the face of a few getting rich. The Communist dictatorship contributed its share of suppressing any nascent form individualism.
Since the Vietnamese were the main buyers of Cambodian wood over a longer period of time the Khmer people came to see them as the main villains, which were later complemented by the other Asian nationalities, such as the Thais, Malays, and Indonesians. The population also knew very well that Hun Sen had been installed by the Vietnamese government during their occupation. So they continued and still continue to see the Vietnamese as their oppressors, trying to steal their land.
Though Cambodia is nominally a democratic free country, Hun Sen and his government rule the country with an iron fist, suppressing any emerging strong opposition with any means available, including intimidation, vote-buying, phony law-suits, etc. The masses remain more or less docile as Hun Sen’s CPP network pervades all strata of government throughout Cambodia. The one opposition party was rendered leaderless at one time for almost 2 years by having the chairman, Sam Rainsy, sentenced to a jail term for defamation of Hun Sen. Sam Rainsy was later pardoned by the King and returned to Cambodia, albeit in a much more agreeable and pliable form.
Nevertheless, Sam Rainsy and his party lambaste the CPP for stuffing voter rolls with Vietnamese nationals to ensure an absolute victory for the CPP in the next elections to be held in July 2008.
Sam Rainsy is practically running on an anti-Vietnamese platform.
Current Khmer society on the whole is rather uneducated, and that includes the upper echelons of the country’s leadership. Cambodia lacks an educated elite, from which impulses can arise and be passed on to the general population. This, of course, is the result of the virtual annihilation of the existing elite under the Pol Pot regime. This tends to make people to think in very simple terms and to see things in black and white. They are not able to make educated and informed assessments and judgments of given situations. They are very susceptible and responsive to blaming outsiders for their misfortune.
Again, looking back in history this appears to be a false impression, as it was their own King who asked the French for help. And it was again their own King who did not object to an arbitrary French ruling that gave the so-called Cochin-China to Vietnam, also called Kampuchea Krom, which covered the Mekong Delta and which had and still has a Khmer minority, when French rule over their Indochinese colonies ended.
Kampuchea Krom is a very serious bone of contention between the nationalistic faction of the Khmer population, especially overseas Khmer, and the current Cambodian government and the Vietnamese government. The resultant dislike or hate from this fact is unfortunately extended to the entire Vietnamese people who are seen as land-grabbers, and generally dishonest and shifty people. But it must not be overlooked that this part of Vietnam, though originally settled by Khmer, has been Vietnamese for 4 centuries. To claim it is still Khmer and to have it ceded back now seems somewhat absurd.
It was again a Khmer king who allowed Vietnamese refugees fleeing from a war to settle in this region in the early 17th century. In the following years ever more Vietnamese settled in the region and roughly 90 years later the Vietnamese installed their own administration, which practically separated this region from Cambodia. Cambodia was too weak to counter this because of its ongoing wars with the Thais. Kampuchea Krom has been Vietnamese ever since. The only chance to get it back was in 1954, but the French granted it to Vietnam without any opposition from the then King Norodom Sihanouk.
Lately, the relatively unhindered immigration of Vietnamese in practically free Cambodia has also irked most Cambodians. They also perceive them to receive very favorable treatment by the current government. Additionally, 2 years ago Cambodia and Vietnam concluded a border treaty delineating a firm borderline for many previously contested regions with Vietnam. Large chunks of Cambodian territory are considered to have been ceded to Vietnam by the current government. This claim is made not only by the opposition party but also by the former King Sihanouk.
It appears that all the Khmer contentions that they were wronged by their neighbors is not borne out by historical facts. But nonetheless a sort of inferiority complex evolved from this, which continues to make this a very volatile issue in some quarters. The Kampuchea Krom and border issues also leave the very bitter taste that the Cambodian people always get the short end of the stick in their relationship with their neighbors.
Nevertheless, the Vietnamese ‘guest laborers’ that had come to Cambodia in search of jobs in the early 1990s were considered good and reliable workers, much better in many respects than their Khmer counterparts. This fact was underlined by many Khmer builders who exclusively used Vietnamese workers in the construction business in that time. This picture has slowly changed over the years as Khmer workers acquired the skills to put them on an equal footing with the Vietnamese.
The U. N. sponsored elections in 1993 and its preparation brought in a great number of U. N. forces from all over the world, which was seen as a great opportunity to make money by prostitutes. Consequently, a great number of Vietnamese ladies of the night came to Cambodia to ply their trade there. As a matter of fact, during that time about 90% of all prostitutes in Cambodia were Vietnamese. Decent Khmer people saw this with dismay and lumped all the Vietnamese together as pimps, prostitutes, and thieves. Seeing Cambodia as a practically lawless country at that time this also appears to have been the time when criminals began using Cambodia as a major transit point for human trafficking. Again, many of those gangsters have been Vietnamese, though many young rural Vietnamese girls are also their victims.
In comparison to Vietnam Cambodia is a free country, though not fully by Western standards. But this continues to lure Vietnamese (and Chinese) people in search of jobs to Cambodia. Unlike Vietnam (and China) life is virtually uncontrolled by any authority, nobody pays taxes, and if you are apolitical Cambodia compares very favorably to their home country. Vietnamese do not need visas to enter Cambodia but Khmer need visas to go to Vietnam.
The Thai and Vietnamese economies are much larger and stronger. Vietnam, despite its still Communist authoritarian rule, managed to elevate its country from a developing to a threshold country in the past 19 years, whereas Cambodia in almost 15 years of quasi-democratic rule is still dependent on foreign aid for 50% of its budget. Before Cambodia will reach the same level of development it will take at least another 10 to 15 years. There are, of course, vast disparities in both countries’ infrastructure, but it would seem that the rigid authoritarian Vietnamese rule accomplished more than the robber-baron rule of a capitalist Cambodia. The ruling clique there is seen to line its pocket to the detriment of their own people hampering progress for the benefit of the people.
Given all these facts and aspects it is easy to understand, at least on the surface, the dislike, aversion, or even hate some Khmer people harbor against the Vietnamese. On the other hand, there is a great number of marriages between these two nationalities. There seem to be two factions utilizing this anti-Vietnamese feeling – one, the overseas Khmer who for the most part are very nationalistic, similar to their overseas Vietnamese counterparts, and two, the opposition parties in the country. Overall the population in Cambodia might not really like their neighbors but they have come to accept their presence and live with it. At worst, I believe it may be called an ambivalence.
For the overseas Khmer, however, judging from their publications, it is outright hate. Of course, it is safe for them to rant and rave living more or less comfortably in the U. S. or France. But their contention that Vietnam will one day occupy Cambodia again is outright ludicrous. Of course, Vietnam and Thailand will pursue their interest in their dealings with Cambodia, but the times of outright colonialism in any shape or form are forever over. No Western or Asian power will stand by and watch Vietnam annex Cambodia. Thailand has never committed any acts of aggression against their neighbors in modern times anyway and one is hard-put to see Thailand invading Cambodia.
Both Thais and Vietnamese are very friendly and hospitable, the same as Khmer. It is hard to understand for a foreigner to see some Khmer to usurp these sentiments for their one-sided goals. Shouldn’t reconciliation be the major objective? One can only hope that the younger generation, which will be more educated and because of their exposure to the mass media and internet, will come to see these things in their proper context and use their minds and ambition to build a better society free from hatred against their neighbors.
Europeans know about this best. They managed to unite countries that had been at war throughout history into one union without borders, with a common currency, and a joint political body. Yes, there are still resentments among certain nationalities. It is noteworthy, though, that it is mostly lower class people who hold those resentments. The better educated the more open-minded the people will be. Similarly, once the young Khmer will have achieved at least a semblance to other nations in the region, and have gained some stature among their neighbors, those resentments or harsher sentiments will slow diminish and finally disappear, maybe not completely, but they won’t be a significant factor in their relationships with their neighbors.
As for overseas Khmer, their views ought to basically be discounted as they have no major influence in Cambodia itself. They are too far removed from events and do not have the wherewithal to play a major role in Cambodian politics. There are about 300,000 overseas Khmer in the U. S. and Europe. Most of them have enough on their hands carving out a living in their host countries to care about politics in Cambodia. Eventually, the second and third generation will assimilate into their host societies completely and not think of themselves as Khmer but as Americans and French, or whatever they are. But the present anti-Vietnamese, anti-Thai propagandists should try to educate themselves a little more in order to understand that the world is not black and white, and that fostering hate is self-defeating and negativistic. Hate has no long-term chance of survival.
34 comments:
Ah Bat phasa kiynoum Hunsen like youn b/c,Ah hun sen get benefit from Ah youn communist....
san sathear lon bitch....
ah Bat phasa kiynoum youn hun sen like youn b/c , Ah hunsen get benefit from Ah youn communist...
sathear san lon bitch...
The hatred is even deeper than that. You have no idea how many times in history we've tried to negotiate and compromise with the Vietnamese and the many times they have falsified their agreements with us. Your speaking in generalization and minor assumptions as to why their is animosity toward them.
I think this guy works for youn's government and hun sen. He needs to do more research on why Cambodians hav the animosity toward their neighbors. This must be a school paper for his degree. Very poor written. Some of the paragraphs are not related to the main idea. The article does not show the truth, it is bias toward youn.
We have historically and proportionately derived the term "Yuon" predicated on the afflictions and tribulations in which Yuon had afflicted upon Cambodia and its people; further, the the complicity and culpability they shared during the Khmer Rouge genocide.
It is critically imperative and paramount that we do not forget that the Yuons are our historic and archenemy.
Again, it is a matter of the utmost importance to label the Vietnamese as "Yuon," because this is not unjustified and disproportionate to do so.
Yes, I am proud to declare every day is a momentous day that I have the opportunity to call the Vietnamese "Yuon."
Khmer forever! Yuon out of Cambodia!
" Kampuchea Krom, which covered the Mekong Delta and which had and still has a Khmer minority, when French rule over their Indochinese colonies ended"
The author of this article is ha youn vietcong.
Otherwise his wife is youn.
He doesn't know anything about history.
He learns history at Hanoi university like Hunsen.
Correction to 7:02 PM
"But it must not be overlooked that this part of Vietnam, though originally settled by Khmer, has been Vietnamese for 4 centuries. To claim it is still Khmer and to have it ceded back now seems somewhat absurd."
FUCK THE YUON
KILL ALL YUON
YUOUN HAS NO RIGHT TO LIVE IN SROK KHMER
FUCK ALL YUONS
ALL YUONS NEED TO BE EXECUTED BY ONE BULLET TO THE BACK OF THE HEAD
OR BURN THEM ALIVE
ALL YUON NEED TO GET THE FUCK OUT OF CAMBODIA AND TAKE YOUR LAND MINES WITH YOU
THIS FUCKHEAD 7:04 PM SHOULD BE EXECUTED THEN BURN AND SEND ASHES TO YOUR YUON SOIL
Vietnam did not withdraw from Cambodia in 1988. Vietnam only announced that they would withdraw in 1989 and in fact didn't withraw until the 90
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=950DE6D71431F935A35757C0A96F948260
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vietnam_People's_Army
No objections were made from Cambodia king to France decision to hand over Cochin-China were a falsication of history, the very own assertion which the author based Khmer resentment towards Vietnam.
"On 18th June, 1948, H. M. Norodom Sihanouk protested by letter, and in 1949 he sent a Cambodian delegation to Paris to attend the debate in the French Parliament on the bill dealing with Cochin-China's new status and accession to Viet-Nam, and to formulate protests against the integration of a Cambodian territory (Cochin-China) into Vietnam."
KhmerKrom.Org
Every King throughout Cambodian history laid claim to that area and in fact as the authors points out, had numerous warfare with the neighbors...why??? because Cambodia still assert claims to those territory and saw the acts of the separatist Vietnamese community in Kampuchea-Krom as illegal colonization of their country. From his majesty Ang Doung down to Sihanouk, no Cambodia King has ever denied claim to Kampuchea-Krom until it was no longer possible and practical to do so (After the de facto unification of Vietnam, when French made final decision to give Cochin China to Bao Dai)
The assertion that educated Khmers will see clearly and be "open-minded" and the fact that he generalize the oversea khmer to be anti-vietnamese, he makes the big generalization that Khmer people are narrow-minded have intellectual incapacity to not be able to distinguish right from wrong, abstract from concrete, and history from imaginations, and unable to accept tolerate Vietnamese culture or see the big human picture.
Why should Cambodia not and the author, raise eyebrown at the fact that Cambodia need visa to visit Vietnam not vice/versa.
On the general, he based his entire assumption on the few clicks of buttons and internet forums he read, generalized a vague but broad claim to an entire population and further he provides very little to clear social/political/historical basis behind the problem and dismis them as mere constructs of Cambodian complex-inferiority,imagination,and falsication of actual events.
The the pool of his survey and study (the INTERNET oversea Khmers), his western background of education and reconcialation heritage, fail to see the unreliable sources of his assumptions.
Based on these, that he made assumptions based on an unrealiable and unsystematic studies and methods, based on incredible personal interpretations of historical/facts/politics,based on broad and vague generalizations. His whole argument breaks itself down in my face and seem to incredible to have any deep value or study.
There are many sources already written on the Cambodia-Vietnam conflicts, I suggest he invest some time to research those before making absurd assertions like these.
--------------------------------------
Youn, does not mean by 5:39's reason, and Youn are used in Khmer and Cambodia not because Khmer politicians/people/king/religion/nation have contempt for Vietnamese people, they are simple phonic derivation of the word Viet or Yiec, a term which is widely use by Vietnamese themselves. And there is only that word in Khmer language for Vietnamese(western contempt for adding an Ese to the end? or just western grammar rules and spelling system???) Of course that is not a quesiton. We know that this is the way western system works with country names.
Look up in the dictionary and there are no other meaning for the Khmer word, Youn, except, Youn-neigbhoring ethnic people of the YOun ehtnic race. Choun Nath (Cambodian famous Sumpreme Patriach Monk) dictionary.
I am Khmer-Kampuchea-Krom Person,
I used the word Youn when I speak in Khmer, Vietnamese when I speak in English, I do not hate Vietnamese,
I hate Vietnam government,
Strongly resent Vietnam policies,
Disturbed by amount of influence Vietnam has on Cambodia
Am i wrong to have these feelings?
Or is my life and experience up to the personal interperation of that author?
Author, thank you for taking your time to write this article. I understand that you have a good intention when you wrote this article. In the contrary, to your intention, your article stired up more hatred due to your limited knowledge of our history.
Khmer
You, the author of this article is a complete moron. get all your facts straig first before making erroneous judgment and assumption.
1 - In 1954, the Khmer king did send a delegates to protest the handover of Khmer Krom to ah Youn.
2 - If Khmer don't continue to resist, the Youn and Siam will completely control Khmer one day. After the youn invasion, they try to forced all Khmer to learn youn in the classroom. Did you know that?
3 - You said that the oversea Khmer views should be discounted. You are a moron that is making an uneducated assertion. We, the oversea Khmer support many of our people and families back home because of the Hun Sen puppet regime to ah Youn is not doing their job. We have every rights to continue and voice our opinions to help our homeland and family for whom, the majority do not freely have access to all the correct information and the rights to make and an inform decision.
4 - Thailand never commit any act of aggression? You are an idiot. Thailaind took took over Battambang and other provinces during WWII and only handed back after the French forced them to. They still kept Surin and other Khmer province until today. Same with Prea Vhear, Khmer only got it back after the Hague tribunal. They continue to encroach the borders and killing Khmer ever other days. Did you know that?
We Khmer still have a lot to learn and trust each others, but don't come here and accused us that our passion for our country is based solely on hate. No one is going to hate anyone if they did didn't do anything wrong to them. No one is going to defend our country if we don't, certainly not you in this case.
Maybe now you should go and talk to your friend in Palestine and tell him that he's wrong for hating the Isreali for taking their land and killing their countrymen.
Yes, maybe some day we will all be assimilated and live as once and that is probably a thousand years from now when the Chinese population overflow to all of mainland asians country.
Your paper distort A LOT of Facts. If this is school paper or published work, you need to cite your facts..
This is an F.
When one talk about a serious issue such racial hatred and one needs to talk base on one experience! The author of this article is talking base on false perception, false assumption, false history, and reverse psychology to make Khmer people as hate mongers!
There is a saying that if you want to know the criminal and you have to live with the criminal! In this case, Khmer people had been living next to the Thaicong and the Vietcong for century to know their real black heart toward Khmer and Khmer people continue to be a victim of their aggression! The aggression of the Thaicong and the Vietcong on Cambodia are mainly based on subservient Khmer leaders or King who was put in power by them and through them, they manipulated the Khmer leaders or King’s power to make way for the Thaicong and the Vietcong aggressive policy at the expense of Khmer people! At this point in time, the Khmer leaders or King must take a stand and uphold more assertive policy against the Thaicong and the Vietcong aggressive policy otherwise Khmer people will be disappeared little by little through the signing of fake border treaties and massive illegal immigration from neighboring country! Khmer leaders can look to Singapore for some role model and how these Singaporean can protect their tiny Singapore surrounded by muslin countries from million and million muslin people!
It is unfortunate that Cambodia is surrounded by bad neighbors even if Cambodia want to live peacefully with their neighbors and their neighbors don't give a fuck anyway because they think that they are bigger and better mentally or morally than Khmer population and what the Thaicong and the Vietcong government do to Khmer population doesn't cost them a thing and their perception of Cambodia is nothing more than a slave or a commodity that can be exploited, exchanged, and trade for profit and their aim is to create more instability and war! And through out history the only way the Thaicong and the Vietcong can achieved their maximum exploitation of Cambodia is through war and instability for these reasons the Thaicong and the Vietcong won't accommodate any Khmer politic regarding economic, illegal immigrant, and border issues!
The Khmer population has the right to hate the Thaicong and the Vietcong like any criminal or invader because they don’t make life easier for Khmer population anyway and this is to show you that even in the 21 century (2008) and Khmer population still have problems with the Thaicong and the Vietcong otherwise Khmer population won’t be talking or discussing about these Thaicong and Vietcong issues!
Instead of looking at the broad context you mostly resort to petty arguments and personal attacks, invectives and insults. I have been observing this quality on KI-Media posts for a long time. Though KI-Media as such is a laudable effort, the quality of the comments is for the most part rather unqualified. And ...people who can't speak and write English properly shouldn't grade comments.
Your responses only underline the assumption that because of the historically weaker position of Cambodia a deep-seated aversion has developed in many Khmer, and it is most vociferously expressed by overseas Khmer.
The op-ed is not a treatise on history but an attempt at trying to find the causes for this animosity and to understand it. The prevalent response was that the author must be a Vietnamese agent. How ridiculous. Your remarks in themselves disqualify you.
Sometimes it takes outsiders to understand problems of other people better. They are unbiased, as they have no stake in the conflict, whereas Khmer certainly do take sides - and there is nothing wrong with that.
The few historical facts cited stand, whether or not Sihanouk sent a letter or a delegation. After all, the French only reconfirmed what had been a fact for 400 years - Kampuchea Krom has been Vietnamese since that time. Sorry about that but that's what it is. Your history may have been tragic but you are not unique in that situation. The same thing happened in Europe over and over again, Alsace is French, though it was once German, other parts are now Polish, though once German, Britain was Roman, French, Danish before it became England, Scotland, and Wales, and so on, and so on.
Cambodia has been the weaker country in dealing with its neighbors, mostly because of its governments',past and present, ineptitude. Blaming the neighbors for it just isn't right, especially in modern times, when people should be more enlightened. It is time to lay these sentiments to rest.
My impressions and knowledge come from 20 years of affinity to Cambodia, having lived close to 4 years there, and from studying Cambodia intensely, though it may be incomplete. I have taken a neutral position and did not mean to offend anyone, if I did, my apologies. But please remain civil.
Did I cause more hatred because of my op-ed? If so, it probably is in those incorrigible zealots (like 1:10)that seem to populate the comment section of KI-Media almost exclusively. Judging from the text, some of them are still rather young, so I am inclined to attribute their comments to immaturity.
To 1:17AM!
Just shut the fuck up! You have cost more hatred and misunderstanding from your highly educated English language!
You claimed to have 20 years of living in Cambodia? Since you have live in Cambodia for 20 years and did you know that Khmer people are still living under AH HUN SEN Vietcong puppet government since 1979? It is through AH HUN SEN Vietcong puppet government that the Vietcong government can demand AH HUN SEN Vietcong puppet government to deport Cambodian monk Tim Sakhorn to Vietname to be judged under the Vietcong law and to be jailed in the Vietcong prison! This is a clear violation of basic human right!
Sure you like to blame everything on "petty arguments and personal attacks, invectives and insults" But the facts are there and you refuse to see or acknowledge it!
So the case is closed mother fucker and you can go on argue for yourself and I won't be part of it!
stand up Khmners. stop being passive; instead be more aggressive like those evil people, maybe by retaliation. remember what goes around comes around. also, we, Khmers needs to study the differences between the us and the Viets and Thais. it is definitely a cultural difference here when we talk about Cambodia, Vietnam and Thailand. I think historical, we, Khmers, are too passionate in our attitude towards the Thais and the Viets. We might have to change our attitude to be more aggressive towards these two neighbors, especially, when they are being aggressive towards us. Please think about it. thank you
1:40
You prove the point I am making. Your attitude is lamentable. The only language you know is the language of the gutter.
4:21
I believe you mean steadfast. Aggression won't help you with stronger countries.
Let's just have one quick examination of another fact you keep assertting: "After all, the French only reconfirmed what had been a fact for 400 years - Kampuchea Krom has been Vietnamese since that time."
French colonized Kampuchea-Krom, an area called Cochin-China, completely by late 1860s. Before this, lower Cambodia had saw an influx of illegals starting 1620s. That make Vietnamese illegal occupation and seperatist and colonisation of Cambodia for just 200 years before France colonized it. In that 200 year ante-France colonization period, Khmer people have bravely resisted their occupiers (colonisers-but we see Europeans and Angloxans like to have this term exclusive refer to them only and the U.N mandate to decolonisation are effort to mends the rights and guilt they cause to their colonized people) for example the resistance group led by Chavay Son Kuy from Preah Trapeang in the 1830s which saw his martyrdom, an execution by Vietnam in 1841 when he surrender on ground that Vietnam or Annam should lift the impositions of forcing Khmer custom and religious assimilation. That did not see the end of Khmer resistance and challenge to the Annamite aggressors, in 1859 another attempt to free Khmer Krom was made under commander Sena Sous. The resistance movement was quell with his death by poison.
Khmer Serei movement founded in 1958 by a Son Ngoc Thanh, aligned itself with the U.S hoping when a Free South Vietnam came, that the indigenous Khmer-Krom people will have a say so and a voice in the new democracy under American-like constitution
In is a moot point now, but why does European power felt an obligation to remove colonizing power by other members of their European nation, but fail to see that the idea of colonisation is not unique to European alone? Fact is Cambodia lowland had been legally under the Khmer sovereignity and had every cultural and archeological evidence for it, it came under colonization by for two hundred years, and it still had been a contention and wars still broke up between Cambodia and Vietnam, but France in the end of its turn of colonisation, blatantly ignore the indigenous people's concern and hand Cochin China to Bao Dai.
We know decolonisation is impossible because it only reserve for a remedy for the remosed and damaged by the unique and superior western coloniser.
But to alleviate the mistrust in Cambodia, which we all know is substantial and not without real reasons, it is not helpful to deport Cambodian monks who hold Khmer citizenship to be imprison in Vietnam, treat the original Khmer people of South Vietnam as second class and degrade their living conditions by depriving them of their rights to land, livelyhood and cultural freedom.
Vietnam has every opportunity to make it right, and it still do, and until the time where Khmers can achieve equal level of opportunities and full rights in Vietnam, don't count on Khmer forget, forgiving and let go, may that be Khmer overseas, Khmer Phnom Penh, and especially Khmer Krom. We cannot forget those who colonise us.
Now does that translate into your Khmer hate Vietnamese interpretation? For some Khmer this is a factor of their resentment. For me, I am a Khmer Krom, I have lived with Vietnamese for years, and I have became their friends vice versa, but I still in your word, is a bit to crude, so i should say, resent, the country, the dominion of Vietnam over my homeland, my people.
being, educated, being an outsider, being "unbiased" really means nothing. In terms of cultural and anthropolical standpoint, that is ridiculous and absurd statement to make. No one can be culturally unbiased, an outsider, and can see things clearly simply for being an outsider. In facts, it is outsiders who have the most difficulty adjusting to and seeing things from the way they actually really are, because they come, all of them, with an supriority attitude, equipped with all the reasons and assessments of why certain problems arise and the quick solution to them.
You really created a generalisation offend and for many Khmer people. So yes, you are wrong, in my point of view But regardless, whether you are an outider, or an insider, you have the right to your own personal interpretation of this issue.
Everyone is right in some way, but the whole picture definitely cannot be seen by an outsider who doesn't know originally what the puzzle is suppose to be like, can it?
5:05AM Saying:
I try to write my opinion, at an english level, which can make me understandable, in a free of cursed and personal attacks on your article, and posted it on your page. But you denied my opinion.
Here was what I wrote:
To the Author: I disagree with you and here is are some obvious reasons why, your facts-including histories-are not entirely correct, your perspective of history are personal view rather the objective outsider standpoint you want to convey, and your interpretations on the rise the Cambodian resentment attributes to reasons that are unsubstantiated and at best unclear. Connections are best merely on generalizations and assumptions. First, a trivial, but credibility point, you stated that Vietnam withdrawed from Cambodia in 1988. In fact Vietnam did not withdraw from Cambodia after 1989 and only announced it plan to end the occupation of Cambodian in 1989 Here a link for you, New York TimesThe Dark Age Who was responsible for the loss of Cambodian territories? Kong Som Ol's Letter to the French Parliament Cambodia Comemorate loss of Kampuchea-Krom As you can see on this issue,every King throughout Cambodian history laid claim to that area and in fact as you pointed out, there had been numerous warfare in the past between Cambodia and her neighbors before the French occupation...why is that I may ask? That reason you may already know is because Cambodia still assert claims to its territory and saw constant continuos threats and expansion by her neighbors. In the case of Kampuchea-Krom, Cambodia saw the acts of the separatist Vietnamese community in Kampuchea-Krom as illegal colonization of their country. From his majesty Ang Doung down to Sihanouk, no Cambodia King has ever denied claim to Kampuchea-Krom until it was no longer possible and practical to do so (After the de facto unification of Vietnam, when French made final decision to give Cochin China to Bao Dai) You also believe that in the future, Khmer people will be more educated and will see things beyond black and white and have open-mindness and goes on to attribute the Vietnamese "hatred" to the general the oversea khmer(of course myself would be included in this universal quantifier). This is a big generalization, and it goes to say with clear implication that Khmer people are narrow-minded people of intellectual incapacity to not be able to distinguish right from wrong, abstract from concrete, and history from imaginations, and unable to accept or tolerate other cultures specifically that of the Vietnamese, in sort, our people cannot see the big human picture of a "why can't we all get along" picture with a big global human family. In your article you also mention some other political reasons like rights of citizens to travel in Cambodia, how Cambodians require visa to visit Vietnam and not the other way around. I fail to to see why this particular setup does not raise any eyebrown, and why Cambodia should'nt be paranoid, if you will, about this setup. In the general, I believe you based your entire conclusion on an assumption. Assumptions from a few clicks of buttons and internet forums and blogs. Your conclusion are very general and vague, you laid broad assertions to an entire population and further provides very little and clear support in your social/political/historical basis/analysis behind the problem and dismis them as mere constructs of Cambodian complex-inferiority,imagination,and falsication of actual events. Again all of these, you seem, to proudly based on the pool of indirect surveys and study of the discussion( on the INTERNET of oversea Khmers). You proudly proclaim that westerners are much better to uniting people and much more open-minded, of course this is a result of good education-which hopefully all Khmer or Vietnamese in the future in your host nations will get and completely forget about their root. This western background of education and reconcialation heritage, however seem fail to see the unreliable sources from which you based your assumption, and shows the little study you did in the actual project beyond a mere conveying of a personal view. Based on these things:assumptions based on an unrealiable and unsystematic studies and methods, based on incredible personal interpretations of historical/facts/politics,based on broad and vague generalizations. I believe your how whole argument breaks itself down in seem too incredible to have any deep face value for study or future studies. As there are many sources already written on the Cambodia-Vietnam conflicts(mainly main i remind you, from westerners of western trained education). I hope will not offend you to offer a suggest to invest some time to research those before making these assertions, which in my view is truely, "absurd". You did not mention in your article about the usage of the word Youn in Khmer language, but like many westerners who know Cambodian better then they know themselves, please humble yourself my also modest reminder that the term Youn does not mean what some " oversea" Khmer bloggers and forum goers would like to mean. Being a Vietnamese of Khmer Origin (a Khmer Kampuchea Krom) i used this word as normal part of my Khmer diction, even when speaking to Vietnamese who understand Khmer. To speak Khmer, there is no other substitute for the word Youn accept to call them by western taxonomy. Which at the time, i had no idea, no idea that Khmer was called Cambodia or that Nguoi Yiec or Nguoi(people) Viet was called "Viet"'namese'". According to one of the oldest Khmer dictionary compiled by Cambodian past Supreme Patriach Somdach Choun Nath, a great buddhist scholar, Vietnamese only has one meaning-neighboring ethnic people of the ethnic Youn race. I think the summary of your article best is said by one Khmer oversea blogger " Author, thank you for taking your time to write this article. I understand that you have a good intention when you wrote this article. In the contrary, to your intention, your article stired up more hatred due to your limited knowledge of our history. Khmer" -------------------------------------- I am Khmer-Kampuchea-Krom Person, as I said. And, for your curiosity, I do not hate Vietnamese. However I do hate I hate or should i say resent, (i like resent better) our Vietnam government. I Strongly resent Vietnam policies, and deeply disturbed by amount of influence Vietnam has on Cambodia Am i wrong to have these feelings? Or is my life and experience also up to the personal interperation of that author? Does my side of the story count? Maybe not, maybe its only a figment of my imagination. Is my life experience not real until someone other then me objectified it? Maybe that's how it works in the western world. I believe i have a right to express this point of view. You had a right to make this article, therefore, you should give me the right to express my opinion. Otherwise, you are just making things seem more obvious that you had an intention other then free open-minded public discourse.
unfortunately my links were cropped from this version so you can no longer click on them. Sorry quick cut and paste of my saved reply which you refused to look at. If you ever want to, you can still check your blog for those links.
"This seems to be somewhat surprising given the fact that it was the Vietnamese that liberated Cambodia from its stone age Communist Pol Pot regime"
KJE, just look at your own paragraph you wrote above. You lack even basic knowledge of why Vietnamese decided to risk their own lives to liberate the Khmers from the killing field. What knowledge do you have that you come forth and proclaim that it was a liberation? What, to your knowledge, is the true definition of this word "liberation"? And does it really fit perfectly in this particular scenario? Have you ever heard of Khmer Krom? And how these KK people have been treated by the Vietnamese for many decades since they occupied the KK land? What then the true meaning of liberation of the dying Khmers by the Vietnamese forces? Or was it really a liberation? What make you think that the Vietnamese suddenly volunteered to die so that the Khmer would live? Do you, KJE, really know so much of the history between the Khmer and the Vietnamese? KJE, your term paper for your history class is graded - and it flunks. Shame on you, my friend. KJE, go and have some sex.
KJE,
Re:I had asked because all the Khmer blogs, forums, and other English-language publications on the web display a thorough, deep-seated, and often-times virulent, hate of the Vietnamese people in general and the Vietnamese government in particular. This seems to be somewhat surprising given the fact that it was the Vietnamese that liberated Cambodia from its stone age Communist Pol Pot regime...
I am nixing your assertion because you don't have sufficient political and historical knowledges on Khmer/Cambodia to further deserve a PR for your blog. As a Khmer-American, I consequently ask you to learn more about Khmer and Khmer's history. Until then, please refrain yourself from using such words as "hate" or anything to that effect. You do not know the meaning of it!
Very truly yours,
Crazyglue
WHEN IT COMES TO ISSUES OF DEALING WITH VIETNAM AND THAI, I SEEM TO HAVE A LOT OF THINGS TO SAY. BUT IN SHORT, I HAVE TO AGREE WITH OUR FRIEND, CRAZYGLUE'S COMMENTS.
Just please help us get the Damm Current Gov out in 2008! Thank you
Sick of shit going around over and over!!!
Well, don't read into that article more than there really is. The way I understand it from reading various experts' books on this, the Vietnamese invaded Cambodia to gain hegemony over Indochina. But at the same time they 'liberated' Cambodia from the Pol Pot regime.
Any comment made on my blog will be published as long as does not include personal attacks. I concur that everyone has a right to their opinion, so have I. After all, this is all it is, an op-ed, not a dissertation, and, therefore, naturally subjective.
Anybody accusing me of having insufficient knowledge about Cambodia would be surprised when it came to a round-table discussion. Thankfully, the tone of the last few comments has changed and I appreciate and respect that. I only wish all of the bloggers were like that. And as a final note, I don't generally think that all overseas Khmer are anti-Vietnamese, but it appears as though the majority is. It is from this latter group that Sam Rainsy gets his overseas support. Sam Rainsy's intentions may be good but by running on an anti-Vietnamese platform, this is as what it comes across, he makes those intentions worthless. He may not be anti-Vietnamese, but anti-government, but he should make that clear in his messages. Anyway, thanks to all those who made a constructive, civil comment. I don't mind opposing stand-points, they are part of a discussion.
To 11:32PM
Wow! It would take a round-table discussion just to show off your intelligence on Khmer political history? This is a new one for me! Ahahahhah!
When you start to bullshit something about Khmer issues and it is your job not to be general or to be bias in your limited view base on your selective memory! You need to be more specific with all your fucken discussions!
For example! You kept bullshiting over and over again that the Vietcong "liberated" Cambodia from the Pol Pot regime! But did you give any specific details to back up your claimed that the Vietcong did liberate Cambodia from the Pol Pot regime? No you didn't! It is a fact when the Vietcong invaded Cambodia and they occupied Cambodia for 10 years from 1979 to 1989, 1993...1997! It is a fact during the 10+ years of the Vietcong occupation of Cambodia, Khmer people never find peace and freedom and more Khmer people are conscripted as Vietcong slave soldiers dying fighting the never ending civil war between Khmer and Khmer! It is a fact that the Vietcong installed AH HUN SEN Vietcong slave puppet government since 1979 and it is still in power today! It is a fact that the Vietcong consulted with the Soviet Union and signed 25 years friendship to get more political support, military support, and economic support before invading Cambodia! It is the Soviet Union made the Vietcong invasion possible because of their support and it would be more logical to say that it is the Soviet Union who is the one to liberated Cambodia from the Pol Pot regime and the Vietcong are nothing more than a foot soldier for the Soviet Union! It is a fact that without the Soviet Union support of the Vietcong and the Vietcong would never dare to invade Cambodia in the first place!
As far as I am concerned the Vietcong government is way more extreme being anti-Khmer than any Khmer anti-Viet because the Vietcong government won't let the Khmer Krom peace live in peace and always subject them to oppression, separation, and prison even those so called Khmer who are living under AH HUN SEN Vietcong slave former Khmer Rouge regime still don’t have freedom! If you really think that majority of Khmer are so anti-Viet and how can million and million of illegal Viet can live in Cambodia peacefully and they even break Cambodian law! So Khmer people including Mr. Sam Rainsy will have to accept whatever the Vietcong government forces down their throat even if the Viet break Cambodian law? Hell no! If the fucken Viet want to be loved by Khmer maybe it time for them to treat Khmer people like a human being!
Now you know why when the Soviet Union withdrew their military force occupation from Afghanistan and the Vietcong will have no choice except to withdraw their military force occupation from Cambodia too!
Thanks God there is one Khmer person that can speak up for Khmer the we expect ourself to be heard!
For your record on Sam Rainy supporter generalizations,
I support Sam Rainsy, if these things make me Anti-Vietnamese, then essentially you are right all Cambodians are anti-Vietnamese.
He runs for:
*Human Rights
*Anti-Land Grab/Anti-Forced Evictions
*Anti-Corruption
*Judcial and Independent government branches
*Anti-Authority Violence and Impunity
*Anti-monopolism
*Anti-Human Trafficking
*Anti-Patronage System
*New and Progressive minds and inclusiveness of youth people
And also runs for these things which you accuse as Anti-Vietnamese:
*Cambodia's right to an Independent and Sovereign nation without foreign control in Khmer politics
*Protecting the citizens of Cambodia from being kidnap by foreign neighbors
*Anti-Encroachmen
and uh oh here comes, the biggest ANTI-VIETNAMESE PLATFORM of all....
*anti-illegal immigrations.
Please correct me if I am wrong, illegal immigration is the biggest issue here among the subjects dear to majority of Americans and their politicians.
We can talk about American racism here later. But having face a similar problem of limited resources, high unemployment, inflation,and others,no one can understand this America anti-illegal "Mexicans" and European's anti-illegal African immigration policy more then the Cambodians, so we will reserve from judgement of racism on you.
Cheers!
10:09
I misrepresented the SRP by singling out that one issue to highlight the point at hand. Sorry about that. Yes, of course, the SRP's program is all that but is it offering concrete programs on how to implement all this 'anti-' platform?
The SRP platform has distributed out it's 101 plans and goals for development of Cambodia a long time ago. If you are interested on how SRP plan to tackle those issues you might be interested in visiting their website but better yet, since you have opportunity to live in Cambodia also, you have chance to meet SRP MPs personally. Mr. Rainsy is very receptive to people, citizens, reporters and international inquirers.
I will vote for people who will speak on these issue and protect citizens from these abuses.
People who blatantly denied the devasting consequences of deforestation don't need to say they have platform, even if they pile a platform of 1000 pages in front of my eye, i will not believe.
The thing that sets SRP and other opposition party apart from CPP is that they recognizes the issue and do not deny the problem.
People who advertise everything is gleam and happy in Cambodia and problems result from the igorance and stupidity of the common people who do not know the law (CPP and their Pro mouth piece CTN which broadcast around the world), cannot solve anything. Because they do not see anything wrong in their country run by errless supreme moha dechos and moha senas.
Dear fellow KI-Media readers et al...
As on any or all other unmoderated blog on-line, KI-Media is no exception when it comes to emotional, angry or even uncontrollable expression of frustrations towards the Viet controlled regime in P. Penh and sometime anonymously towards each other between the readers themselves.
Needless to say that I, personally as one of KI-Media reader, would not condone or encourage such rather chaotic way of personal expressions, but amidst all of that KI-Media comes to exist and to serve its purpose:
Dedicated to publishing sensitive information about Cambodia.
Thanks a million for everything.
Passer-by
Even the Universe is full of chaos and there is still order in the Universe! So what you make you think that KI-Media is so chaotic and there is no order?
Out of chaos there is order and God design it that way!
And Yes 1:27PM, out of of chaos there is order. Finally, some one like you come to understand and reinforce what I was trying to get across. Thanks.
To 7:58PM
Please try to understand that man-made order is not needed! Please don’t worry too much about the so called chaotic personal behavior in KI-Media because this is what you called a competing interest and I know no government on Earth can accommodate all the Khmer interest but Hun Sen must do his best to accommodate the most basic right and needs of Cambodian people such freedom of expression, freedom of association, freedom of the press and affordable housing, affordable quality education, affordable healthcare, economic justice from dangerous product, unscrupulous middlemen, and government monopoly…
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