Interviewed by Chheang Bopha
Cambodge Soir
Translated from French by Luc Sâr
Chhay Hoc Pheng, judge at the Evry court (France), formed in France a Committee of the victims of the Khmer Rouge in 1999, in order to streamline the fight for the defense of the victims’ rights. While the Extraordinary Chambers (ECCC or Khmer Rouge Tribunal) was being formed, an Associaiton of the victims of the Khmer Rouge was formed in Cambodia in 2005. The goal of this association is to collect complaints and testimonies of Cambodian citizens in preparation for the trial. However, Chhay Hoc Pheng doubts the ECCC, which would be moving ahead in the next few months, would allow the totality of the victims to be represented.
Chheang Bopha of Cambodge Soir (CS): How do you plan to proceed to file the complaints to the ECCC?
Chhay Hoc Pheng (CHP): The Association will distribute a form to the victims so that they can describe in their own words, their experience under the Democratic Kampuchea. We will convert these testimonies into official complaints.
I was told that the 150 witnesses who will be heard by the ECCC have already been selected. This means that the victims who regrouped themselves within the Association have done it for nothing, and that their testimonies will not be taken into account. I want to convince the Tribunal to recognize these victims in the same manner as the other victims are being recognized. I understand that the budget and duration of the trial are limited, but I would like to see the ECCC opened to all the victims, those from our association, as well as from others. The tribunal cannot work alone. One hundred and fifty people cannot represent the entire country.
Regarding the complaints, it would be clearer to gather the plaintiffs according to the crimes committed against them and the regional location, because the genocide took place in the entire country. The 1979 trial which did not satisfy any international standards, at least fulfilled the following goal: thumbprints were collected from the public to constitute the complaints.
CS: Do you feel that the public is afraid of taking part in the trial?
CHP: Cambodian people did not forget their past. They are courageous, but very ill informed on their rights. Some still think that becoming a witness or filing a complaint can be perceived as revenge that will anger the current leaders or provoke a national crisis. The goal of our association and of the tribunal is to inform them and to reassure them.
CS: Is the crime of “genocide” included in the complaints you collect?
CHP: Yes, and then some. Some people, like historian Jacques Semlin who is the CNRS (‘Centre National de la Recherche Scientifique,’ France National Center for Scientific Research) director, thinks that the Khmer Rouge are guilty of crimes against humanity and not guilty of genocide. I do not agree with that. The definition of genocide in the [context of the] 1948 Convention (Crimes aimed at “destroying in its entirety or in part a national, ethnic, racial or religious group”) does not distinguish between foreigners and natives. In my opinion, one can talk about genocide when there is [physical] elimination of a group of men and women, and in this case, that of the April 17 [citizens of Phnom Penh]. I understand the designation of “national group” as being a “group of people forming one same nation.” I find it somewhat indecent to try to split the hair [on this semantic]. This Convention was written after the Shoa (the killing of the Jewish people by the Nazis): we must go beyond the context of the 40s.”
Chheang Bopha of Cambodge Soir (CS): How do you plan to proceed to file the complaints to the ECCC?
Chhay Hoc Pheng (CHP): The Association will distribute a form to the victims so that they can describe in their own words, their experience under the Democratic Kampuchea. We will convert these testimonies into official complaints.
I was told that the 150 witnesses who will be heard by the ECCC have already been selected. This means that the victims who regrouped themselves within the Association have done it for nothing, and that their testimonies will not be taken into account. I want to convince the Tribunal to recognize these victims in the same manner as the other victims are being recognized. I understand that the budget and duration of the trial are limited, but I would like to see the ECCC opened to all the victims, those from our association, as well as from others. The tribunal cannot work alone. One hundred and fifty people cannot represent the entire country.
Regarding the complaints, it would be clearer to gather the plaintiffs according to the crimes committed against them and the regional location, because the genocide took place in the entire country. The 1979 trial which did not satisfy any international standards, at least fulfilled the following goal: thumbprints were collected from the public to constitute the complaints.
CS: Do you feel that the public is afraid of taking part in the trial?
CHP: Cambodian people did not forget their past. They are courageous, but very ill informed on their rights. Some still think that becoming a witness or filing a complaint can be perceived as revenge that will anger the current leaders or provoke a national crisis. The goal of our association and of the tribunal is to inform them and to reassure them.
CS: Is the crime of “genocide” included in the complaints you collect?
CHP: Yes, and then some. Some people, like historian Jacques Semlin who is the CNRS (‘Centre National de la Recherche Scientifique,’ France National Center for Scientific Research) director, thinks that the Khmer Rouge are guilty of crimes against humanity and not guilty of genocide. I do not agree with that. The definition of genocide in the [context of the] 1948 Convention (Crimes aimed at “destroying in its entirety or in part a national, ethnic, racial or religious group”) does not distinguish between foreigners and natives. In my opinion, one can talk about genocide when there is [physical] elimination of a group of men and women, and in this case, that of the April 17 [citizens of Phnom Penh]. I understand the designation of “national group” as being a “group of people forming one same nation.” I find it somewhat indecent to try to split the hair [on this semantic]. This Convention was written after the Shoa (the killing of the Jewish people by the Nazis): we must go beyond the context of the 40s.”
No comments:
Post a Comment